John 16:3 And these things will they do unto you,

Spoken to: 

Apostles

Context: 

After the Last Supper, after Jesus says they will try to kill them.

KJV : 

John 16:3 And these things will they do unto you, because they have not known the Father, nor me.

Literal Verse: 

And these things they will bring about because they have learned to know neither my Father nor me.

What is Lost in Translation: 

The word translated as "known" here also means "perceive," but it means perceiving with the mind, that is, understanding. Because none of us can be said to truly know or perceive or understand either Jesus or the Father, The "these things" that we do is think that persecuting others is rending a service or sacrifice to the Divine.

My Takeaway: 

We can only persecute others if we assume we know more than we do.

Greek : 

Greek Vocabulary: 

καὶ [1089 verses](conj/adv) "And" is kai, which is the conjunction joining phrases and clauses, "and," or "also." After words implying sameness, "as" (the same opinion as you). Used in series, joins positive with negative "Not only...but also." Also used to give emphasis, "even," "also," and "just."

ταῦτα [96 verses](adj pl neut acc) "These things" is tauta, which is a referring pronoun meaning "these," "this," "that," and "here." It can mean the nearer or the further depending on usage. As an adverb it can mean "therefore" and "that is why."

ποιήσουσιν [168 verses](verb 3rd sg pres ind act or 3rd pl fut ind act) "Do" is poieo, which means "to make," "to produce," "to create," "to bring into existence," "to bring about," "to cause," "to perform," "to render," "to consider," "to prepare," "to make ready," and "to do." The accusative object is what is made. Double accusative is to do something to someone. When it has a genitive object, it means "made from." When it doesn't have an object, the verb is translated as  "perform" or simply "do." When used with an accusative infinitive, it means to "cause" or "bring about." A dative object means "made with."  With the preposition "into" (eis) it means "made into."

ὅτι [332 verses](adv/conj) "That" is hoti, which introduces a statement of fact "with regard to the fact that," "seeing that," and acts as a causal adverb meaning "for what," "because," "since," and "wherefore."

οὐκ [269 verses](partic) "Not" is ou , the negative adverb for facts and statements, negating both single words and sentences.  The other negative adverb, μή applies to will and thought; οὐ denies, μή rejects; οὐ is absolute, μή relative; οὐ objective, μή subjective.

ἔγνωσαν [62 verses] (verb 3rd pl aor ind act) "Have... known" is ginosko which means "to learn to know," "to know by reflection or observation," and "to perceive."

τὸν [821 verses](article sg masc acc)  "The" is the Greek definite article, hos, ("the"). 

πατέρα [191 verses](noun sg masc acc) "The Father" is pater, which means "father," "grandfather," "author," "parent," and "forefathers."

οὐδὲ [51 verses](partic) "Neither" is oude, which, as a conjunction, means "but not," "neither," and "nor." As an adverb that means "not at all" or "no even" and, literally, "not, however."

ἐμὲ [49 verses](pron 1st sg masc acc) "Me" is eme, which is the objective first-person, objective, singular pronoun that means  "me."

KJV Analysis: 

And -- The Greek word translated as "and" is used as the conjunction "and," but it also is used to add emphasis ("also"). In a series, it can be translated as "not only...but also." After words implying sameness "as."

these -- The "these" is a pronoun that can mean "this" or "that," the nearer or the further depending on usage. It follows the noun so it repeats the idea of the noun as "this one." It is often used in the neuter plural to refer to "these things."

things -- Though the subject is plural, the verb is singular because neuter plural verbs are treated as a collective.

will -- This helping verb "will" indicates that the verb is the future tense, which it could be. Helping or auxiliary verbs are needed to translate the Greek verb forms into English.

they -- This is from the third-person, plural form of the verb.

do -- The Greek word translated as "do" has the primary meaning of "making" or producing" something or "causing" or "performing" as service. When it means It describes a productive action.  In English, "do" is also frequently a helper verb. This Greek word is not used as broadly.

unto you, -- (OS) There is nothing in the Greek that can be translated as "until you" in the source we use today but it does exist in the source that the KJV translators used.

because -- The word translated as "because" introduces a statement of fact or cause, "for what," "because," "since," and "wherefore."

they -- This is from the third-person, plural form of the verb.

have -- (WT) This helping verb "have" indicates that the verb is the tense indicating an action completed in the past. This is not the tense of the verb here.

not -- The Greek word translated as "not" is the Greek negative used to deny objective facts, not opinions. It means "no," "not," or"no truly." It makes a negative statement of fact. Adding "really" to the sentence captures the same idea. When a negative precedes the verb, it affects the whole clause. When it precedes other words, its force is limited to those words. 

known -- "Known" is a verb that means "to know," "to recognize," "make known," "to know carnally," and "to learn." The idea of "realize" seems to capture most senses of this word better than "know," which is the meaning of "have seen."

the -- The word translated as "the" is the Greek definite article; without a noun, it has the sense of "the one." The Greek article is much closer to our demonstrative pronouns ("this," "that," "these," "those") than the English "the." See this article for more. 

Father, -- "Father" is the Greek noun that means "father" or any male ancestor so "forefathers." It is the word that Christ uses to address his own Father.

nor -- The Greek word for "nor" is is an adverb that means "not at all" or "no even" and, literally, "not, however." As a conjunction, it works as both parts of the "neither/nor" constructions.

me.-- "Me" is the regular first-person pronoun in Greek as the object of the verb or preposition. As the object of a preposition, an accusative object indicates movement towards something or a position reached as a result of that movement.

KJV Translation Issues: 

2
  • OS -- Outdated Source -- The Greek word translated as "unto you" existed in the KJV Greek source but not the source we use today.
  • WT - Wrong Tense - The verb "have" indicates the past perfect tense, but the tense is something that happens at a specific point in time (past, present, or future).

NIV : 

John 16:3 They will do such things because they have not known the Father or me.

NIV Analysis: 

missing "and"  -- (MW) The untranslated word  "and" is used as the conjunction "and," but it also is used to add emphasis ("also"). In a series, it can be translated as "not only...but also." After words implying sameness "as."

They -- This is from the third-person, plural form of the verb.

will -- This helping verb "will" indicates that the verb is the future tense, which it could be. Helping or auxiliary verbs are needed to translate the Greek verb forms into English.

do -- The Greek word translated as "do" has the primary meaning of "making" or producing" something or "causing" or "performing" as service. When it means It describes a productive action.  In English, "do" is also frequently a helper verb. This Greek word is not used as broadly.

such -- (WW) The "such" is a pronoun that can mean "this" or "that," the nearer or the further depending on usage. It follows the noun so it repeats the idea of the noun as "this one." It is often used in the neuter plural to refer to "these things."

things -- Though the subject is plural, the verb is singular because neuter plural verbs are treated as a collective.

because -- The word translated as "because" introduces a statement of fact or cause, "for what," "because," "since," and "wherefore."

they -- This is from the third-person, plural form of the verb.

have -- (WT) This helping verb "have" indicates that the verb is the tense indicating an action completed in the past. This is not the tense of the verb here.

not -- The Greek word translated as "not" is the Greek negative used to deny objective facts, not opinions. It means "no," "not," or"no truly." It makes a negative statement of fact. Adding "really" to the sentence captures the same idea. When a negative precedes the verb, it affects the whole clause. When it precedes other words, its force is limited to those words. 

not known the Father or me

known -- "Known" is a verb that means "to know," "to recognize," "make known," "to know carnally," and "to learn." The idea of "realize" seems to capture most senses of this word better than "know," which is the meaning of "have seen."

the -- The word translated as "the" is the Greek definite article; without a noun, it has the sense of "the one." The Greek article is much closer to our demonstrative pronouns ("this," "that," "these," "those") than the English "the." See this article for more. 

Father, -- "Father" is the Greek noun that means "father" or any male ancestor so "forefathers." It is the word that Christ uses to address his own Father.

or -- The Greek word for "or" is an adverb that means "not at all" or "no even" and, literally, "not, however." As a conjunction, it works as both parts of the "neither/nor" constructions.

me.-- "Me" is the regular first-person pronoun in Greek as the object of the verb or preposition. As the object of a preposition, an accusative object indicates movement towards something or a position reached as a result of that movement.

NIV Translation Issues: 

3
  • MW - Missing Word -- The word "and" is not shown in the English translation.
  • WW - Wrong Word -- The word translated as "such" should be something more like "hese."
  • WT - Wrong Tense - The verb "have" indicates the past perfect tense, but the tense is something that happens at a specific point in time (past, present, or future).

Related Verses: 

Front Page Date: 

Nov 17 2022