Spoken to:
Jesus addresses the apostles.
KJV:
Luke 9:23 If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross daily, and follow me.
NIV :
Luke 9:23 Whoever wants to be my disciple must deny themselves and take up their cross daily and follow me.
LISTENERS HEARD:
If anyone wants to show up after me he must reject himself and he must take up that staff of his for a time and he must follow me.
MY TAKE:
We cannot interpret what people thought or heard from our current perspective.
GREEK (Each Word Explained Bottom of Page):
GREEK ORDER:
LOST IN TRANSLATION:
The translation of this verse as "taking up a cross" was only possible after Christ's death. During his lifetime, people would have heard this as "lifting up a walking stick" or "pulling up a stake", as in a tent stake, which were also used as walking stick.
The "let" and "must" is a Greek form known as a "third-party command" but it works like our "must." The "deny" is translated from a Greek word that means "to rejects" and "to deny utterly."
# KJV TRANSLATION ISSUES:
- IW - Inserted Word-- The "man" doesn't exist in the source.
- CW --Confusing Word -- This "will" is not a helping verb indicating the future tense.
- WF -- Wrong Form - This is not an active verb but an infinitive, "to verb."
- WV -- Wrong Voice --This verb is a middle voice, which requires a "by/for himself" or a "himself" as an object.
- CW --Confusing Word -- The verb "let" is not addressed to someone, it is a third-person command.
- WF -- Wrong Form - This is the subject, "he," not an object, "him".
- MW - Missing Word -- The word "the/this" before "cross" is not shown in the English translation.
- CW --Confusing Word -- The "cross" does not capture the word's specific meaning in this situation.
- MW - Missing Word -- The word "over" is not shown in the English translation.
- WF -- Wrong Form - This is not an adverb but an object a preposition.
# NIV TRANSLATION ISSUES:
- CW --Confusing Word -- These are not the common words usually translated as "whoever."
- MW - Missing Word -- The word "show up" is not shown in the English translation.
- WN --Wrong Number- The word "themselves" is translated as plural but the Greek word is singular.
- MW - Missing Word -- The word "the/this" before "cross" is not shown in the English translation.
- CW --Confusing Word -- The "cross" does not capture the word's specific meaning in this situation.
- MW - Missing Word -- The word "over" is not shown in the English translation.
- WF -- Wrong Form - This is not an adverb but an object a preposition.
EACH WORD of KJV :
If -- The "if" here is used to express conditions "if" (implying nothing about its fulfillment) or indirect and direct questions, "whether."It also means "if ever" and "whenever." When used in an "if" clause, the verb is the subjunctive form of possibility. When citing a fact the sense is more "whether," "since" or "as sure as." When this word is paired with the conjunction translated as "but" or "however," the structure works like an "if then" statement in English. With verbs of desire and emotion and the indicative in the second clause, the sense is "that." With an imperative, it is used to express a wish. The sense is "I wish that." With the future tense indicative, it is used for emphasis, a warning, or an intention. The emphasis clause is after the main statement.
any -- The Greek word translated as "any" in the singular means "anyone," "someone," "something," and "anything." The same forms are used both for the masculine or feminine so "anyone" works best for a person. In the plural, it means "everyone," "some," "they," and "those." Jesus often uses it to start a question so it means "who," "what," or even "why."
man -- (IW) There is nothing that can be translated as "man" in the Greek source.
will -- (CW) The Greek word translated as "will" expresses consent and even delight in doing something. It is not the same as the helper verb "will" in English. It means "to consent" and "to be resolved to a purpose." As a participle, it can mean "willingly" and "gladly."
come -- (WF) The word translated as "come" primarily means "to start out" but Jesus usually uses it to mean "come" but not always. It indicates movement, especially its beginning, without indicating a direction toward or away from anything, so it works either as "start," "come," or "go," but it is more like our phrase "being underway." Our English word "show up" captures both the "start" and "come" ideas. See this article for more. This is not an active verb but an infinitive. It is the middle voice.
missing "by/for himself" -- (MV) The middle voice of the previous verb indicates that the subject does something to, for, or by themselves.
after -- The term translated as "after" means "back" in space but "after" in time. It is followed by a possessive which tells us whose back it is. The logic regarding time is that, since the future is unseen, it should be regarded as behind us, whereas the past is known and therefore before our eyes. This seems quite strange to English speakers, but the use of this word in Greek is well-established to mean "future." Our English view coincides with the ancient Greek when discussing books. The "back" of the book in English means the "end" of the book, which is the future for the reader. This use of "back" is identical to the Greek.
me, .-- "Me" is the first-person possessive singular pronoun, "my," "me," and "mine." As a genitive object of a preposition, as here, it means a movement away from something or a position away from something else
let -- (CW) This "let" is the helping verb used to translate the Greek form of the third-person command. In English all commands are in the second person. This form is used as something like our word "must." Using "let" as the active verb, rather than a helper verb like "must," changes the subject from the third party to the second.
him -- (WF) This is from the third-person, singular form of the verb. This is the subject, not an object.
deny "Deny" is translated from a Greek word that means "to rejects" and "to deny utterly." The form is either the future tense or a tense meaning something that might happen at some specific time, past, present, or future. If the word is the "at some time" tense, it is in a form that indicates something that "might" happen. This later "might at some time" form is always used with "if" clauses, which is the sense here.
himself, -- "Himself" is a special reflexive pronoun that means "himself," "herself," and so on. " When used in the possessive, it has the sense of "his own."
and -- The Greek word translated as "and" is used as the conjunction "and," but it also is used to add emphasis, "even," "also," and "just."
take up -- "Take up" is a verb that means "to lift up", "to raise up", "to take up", "to exalt," and "to remove." It is also in the form of a third party command, so "he must".
his -- The word translated as "his" is the Greek word correctly translated as third-person "his/him" in English. The word appears after the noun so the sense is "of his."
missing "the/this" -- (MW) The untranslated word is the Greek definite article," the," which usually precedes a noun or changes the word it precedes (adjective, infinitive, participle, etc.) to act like a noun. The Greek article is much closer to our demonstrative pronouns ("this," "that," "these," and "those"). See this article for more.
cross -- (CW) The word translated as "cross" means a "stake" or "post," like those used to hold up a tent. It does not describe the crossbar of a cross, but the stake on which the crossbar is hung. Among people traveling at the time, it meant pulling up the central stake of a tent to use it as a walking stick. See this article about this word.
missing "over" -- (MW) The untranslated word "over" means "down from," "down into," "against," "over," "opposite," "separately," "at a time," "towards," "in accordance with," "concerning," "corresponding with," "during the course of a period," and "severally." As an adverb is means "downward" or "down."
daily, -- (WF) The Greek word translated as "day" also means "time," in general, and refers specifically to the "daytime." This is not an adverb but an object a preposition. The word could be singular or plural depending on the form. The form also changes the meaning of the previous word.
and -- The Greek word translated as "and" is used as the conjunction "and," but it also is used to add emphasis, "even," "also," and "just."
follow -- The term "follow" means "to follow," or "go with," in a physical sense, but it is also a metaphor meaning "to be guided by" or "to follow the meaning of." This verb takes the indirect form of an object when it is a person.
me. -- The "me" is in the indirect object form of the first-person pronoun, so usually "to me,""for me," and "by me."
EACH WORD of NIV :
Whoever - (CW) This comes from the combination of two Greek words meaning "if anyone." The "if" here is used to express conditions "if" (implying nothing about its fulfillment) or indirect and direct questions, "whether."It also means "if ever" and "whenever." The Greek "anyone" in the singular means "anyone," "someone," "something," and "anything." The same forms are used both for the masculine or feminine so "anyone" works best for a person. In the plural, it means "everyone," "some," "they," and "those." This is not the normal word cobmination translated as "whoever."
wants --The Greek word translated as "wants" expresses consent and even delight in doing something. It is not the same as the helper verb "will" in English. It means "to consent" and "to be resolved to a purpose." As a participle, it can mean "willingly" and "gladly."
to -- This "to" is added because the infinitive form of the verb requires a "to" in English.
be my disciple -- (IP) There is nothing that can be translated as this phrase in the Greek source. IP - Inserted Phrase-- The "be my disciple" doesn't exist in the source.
missing "show up" -- (MW) The untranslated word "show up" primarily means "to start out" but Jesus usually uses it to mean "come" but not always. It indicates movement, especially its beginning, without indicating a direction toward or away from anything, so it works either as "start," "come," or "go," but it is more like our phrase "being underway." Our English word "show up" captures both the "start" and "come" ideas. See this article for more. This is not an active verb but an infinitive. It is the middle voice.
after -- The term translated as "after" means "back" in space but "after" in time. It is followed by a possessive which tells us whose back it is. The logic regarding time is that, since the future is unseen, it should be regarded as behind us, whereas the past is known and therefore before our eyes. This seems quite strange to English speakers, but the use of this word in Greek is well-established to mean "future." Our English view coincides with the ancient Greek when discussing books. The "back" of the book in English means the "end" of the book, which is the future for the reader. This use of "back" is identical to the Greek.
me, .-- "Me" is the first-person possessive singular pronoun, "my," "me," and "mine." As a genitive object of a preposition, as here, it means a movement away from something or a position away from something else.
must -- This "must" is the helping verb used to translate the Greek form of the third-person command. In English, all commands are in the second person. This form is used as something like our word "must."
deny "Deny" is translated from a Greek word that means "to rejects" and "to deny utterly." The form is either the future tense or a tense meaning something that might happen at some specific time, past, present, or future. If the word is the "at some time" tense, it is in a form that indicates something that "might" happen. This later "might at some time" form is always used with "if" clauses, which is the sense here.
themselves , -- (WN) "Themselves " is a special reflexive pronoun that means "himself," "herself," and so on. " When used in the possessive, it has the sense of "his own." This word is not plural but singular.
and -- The Greek word translated as "and" is used as the conjunction "and," but it also is used to add emphasis, "even," "also," and "just."
take up -- "Take up" is a verb that means "to lift up", "to raise up", "to take up", "to exalt," and "to remove." It is also in the form of a third party command, so "he must".
their -- The word translated as "their " is the Greek word correctly translated as third-person "his/him" in English. The word appears after the noun so the sense is "of his."
missing "the/this" -- (MW) The untranslated word is the Greek definite article," the," which usually precedes a noun or changes the word it precedes (adjective, infinitive, participle, etc.) to act like a noun. The Greek article is much closer to our demonstrative pronouns ("this," "that," "these," and "those"). See this article for more.
cross -- (CW) The word translated as "cross" means a "stake" or "post," like those used to hold up a tent. It does not describe the crossbar of a cross, but the stake on which the crossbar is hung. Among people traveling at the time, it meant pulling up the central stake of a tent to use it as a walking stick. See this article about this word.
missing "over" -- (MW) The untranslated word "over" means "down from," "down into," "against," "over," "opposite," "separately," "at a time," "towards," "in accordance with," "concerning," "corresponding with," "during the course of a period," and "severally." As an adverb is means "downward" or "down."
daily, -- (WF) The Greek word translated as "day" also means "time," in general, and refers specifically to the "daytime." This is not an adverb but an object a preposition. The word could be singular or plural depending on the form. The form also changes the meaning of the previous word.
and -- The Greek word translated as "and" is used as the conjunction "and," but it also is used to add emphasis, "even," "also," and "just."
follow -- The term "follow" means "to follow," or "go with," in a physical sense, but it is also a metaphor meaning "to be guided by" or "to follow the meaning of." This verb takes the indirect form of an object when it is a person.
me. -- The "me" is in the indirect object form of the first-person pronoun, so usually "to me,""for me," and "by me."
COMPARISON: GREEK to KJV :
εἰ [90 verses](conj) "If" is ei, which is the particle used to express conditions "if" (implying nothing about its fulfillment) or indirect and direct questions, "whether." It also means "if ever," "in case," and "whenever." In citing a fact, it can mean "as sure as" or "since." It is combined with various conjunctions to create derivative conditions. When appearing as εἰ δὲ (literally, "if however") the sense is "if this...then that." The construction εἰ δὲ μή . . means "otherwise." The construction εἰ οὖν has the sense of "if so." However, it is also used to express a wish. After verbs of wonder, delight, indignation, disappointment, contentment, and similar emotions, it is use instead of ὅτι, to express the object of the feeling in a hypothetical form, "that" with the indicative (not subjunctive). With the future tense, it is used for emphasis, a warning, or an intention.
τις [252 verses](pron sg masc/fem nom) "Any man" is tis, which can mean "someone," "something," "any one," "everyone," "they [indefinite]," "many a one," "whoever," "anyone," "anything," "some sort," "some sort of," "each," "any," "the individual," "such," and so on. In a question, it can mean "who," "why," or "what." Plural, "who are" is τίνες ἐόντες. It has specific meanings with certain prepositions, διὰ τί; for what reason? ἐκ τίνος; from what cause? ἐς τί; to what point? to what end?
θέλει [64 verses](verb 3rd sg pres ind act) "Will" is thelo, which as a verb means "to be willing (of consent rather than desire)," "to wish," "to ordain," "to decree," "to be resolved to a purpose" "to maintain," "to hold," "to delight in, and "will (too express a future event with inanimate objects)." It is a prolonged form (only found in NT) of a verb that means "to be resolved to a purpose" so, in a sense, "to decide," and "to desire." As a participle, it means "being willing" or, adverbially, "willingly," and "gladly." In the Hebrew, "will" or "desire" is chaphets, which means "to delight in," "to take pleasure in," and "to be pleased with."
ὀπίσω [15 verses](prep/adv) "After" is from opiso, which means "back," "behind," and "hereafter."
μου [239 verses](adj sg masc gen) "My" is from mou (emou), which means "me," and "mine." As a genitive object means movement away from something or a position away from something else.
ἔρχεσθαι, [198 verses](verb pres inf mp) "Come" is erchomai, which means "to start," "to set out," "to come," "to go," and any kind of motion. It means both "to go" on a journey and "to arrive" at a place.
ἀρνησάσθω [9 verses](verb 3rd sg aor imperat mp) "Let him deny" is from aparneomai, which means "to deny utterly," "to refuse," "to reject," and "to deny." --
ἑαυτὸν [75 verses] (adj sg masc acc) "Himself" is heautou, is a reflexive pronoun that means "himself," "herself," "itself" "themselves," and "ourselves." It is not the common pronoun meaning simply "he," "she," "them," etc. In the genitive form, it has the sense of "his own."
καὶ [1089 verses](conj/adv) "And" is kai, which is the conjunction joining phrases and clauses, "and," or "also." After words implying sameness, "as" (the same opinion as you). Used in series, joins positive with negative "Not only...but also." Also used to give emphasis, "even," "also," and "just." In a series, it can be translated as "not only...but also." After words implying sameness "as."
ἀράτω [2 verses](verb 3rd sg aor imperat act) "Take up" is from aeirô, which means "to lift up", "to raise up", "to take up", ""to exalt," and "to remove."
τὸν [821 verses](article sg masc acc) Untranslated is the Greek definite article, hos, ("the"). It usually precedes a noun or changes the word it precedes (adjective, infinitive, participle, etc.) to act like a noun. When not preceding a a word that can become a noun, takes the meaning of "the one" or, in the plural, "the ones." Proper nouns do normally not take articles but they are needed when the noun ending cannot be changed to show the noun's role in the sentence as an object, indirect object, or genitive (possessive) form. However, the Greek article is very close to "this" so the purpose of an article like this can also be demonstrative. See this article. -
σταυρὸν [5 verses](noun sg masc acc) "Cross" is from stauros, which means "upright post or stake," "pointed stick," "posts or piles for a foundation," and "a stake for impaling." In Christ's time, it was used for describing the upright post that held the crossbar for crucifixion.
αὐτοῦ [142 verses](adj sg masc gen) "His/" is autou, which means is the singular adjective used as the genitive pronoun, which is used as a possessive form or the object of prepositions and sometimes verbs as opposed to the body and "of one's own accord." This form is often used as the object of a preposition, him." This form of an object of a preposition means a movement away from something or a position away from something else. The time sense of a genitive object is that the event occurred within a specified time. Though the form is masculine, it refers to masculine words, not people. The masculine form is used to refer to people in general, not just men.
κατὰ [60 verses](prep/adv) "Against" is kata can be a preposition or an adverb. As a preposition with the genitive, it means, means "downwards," "down from," "down into," "against," "down toward," "down (from)," and, or time, "for." With the accusative, it means "down (to)," "according to," "about," " during," of motion, "on," "over," "throughout a space," "opposite," "separately," "individually," "at a time," "towards," "in accordance with," "concerning," "corresponding with," "during the course of a period," and "severally." As an adverb, it means "according as," "just as," "in so far as," "wherefore," "like as if" and "exactly as." As an adverb is means "downward" or "down."
ἡμέραν, [96 verses](noun sg fem acc or noun pl fem gen) "Day" is hemera, which, as a noun, means "day" "a state or time of life," "a time (poetic)," "day break" and "day time." It is also and also has a second meaning, of "quiet," "tame (animals)," "cultivated (crops)," and "civilized (people)."
καὶ [1089 verses](conj/adv) "And" is kai, which is the conjunction joining phrases and clauses, "and," or "also." After words implying sameness, "as" (the same opinion as you). Used in series, joins positive with negative "Not only...but also." Also used to give emphasis, "even," "also," and "just." In a series, it can be translated as "not only...but also." After words implying sameness "as."
ἀκολουθείτω [22 verses] (verb 3rd sg pres imperat act ) "Follow" is akoloutheo, which means "to follow," and "to go with." It also means "to be guided by" and means following a leader as a student. Follow is from akoloutheô, which is from a root meaning "first road" (alpha keleuthos ).
μοί, [96 verses](pron 1st sg masc/fem dat) "Me" is moi (emoi) , which can be the object of some prepositions and as the object of a verb means "to me" "for me," and "by me."