Luke 14:33 So likewise, whosoever he be of you that forsaketh not all that he hath

Spoken to: 

audience

The context is two parables: a man calculating the cost before building a tower and a king calculating force before engaging in battle.

KJV: 

Luke 14:33 So likewise, whosoever he be of you that forsaketh not all that he hath, he cannot be my disciple.

NIV : 

Luke 14:33 In the same way, those of you who do not give up everything you have cannot be my disciples.

LISTENERS HEARD: 

In this way, then every one of you who does not set aside to all those of your own accumulating? He doesn't have the power to be my student.

MY TAKE: 

We must sacrifice our old beliefs to learn new truths.

GREEK (Each Word Explained Bottom of Page): 

LOST IN TRANSLATION: 

The key word is translated as "foresake" and "give up," means "set aside." It means "good bye" when addressed to a person.

The word "can" means "doesn't have the power." So the ability to set aside what we have accumulated, including our ideas and plans, prove the ability to learn. The word translated as "disciple" simply means "student." The Bible gives it its religious spin.

# KJV TRANSLATION ISSUES: 

10

So likewise, whosoever(WW) [he be(IW)] of(CW) you that forsaketh(CW) not all that he(CW, WF) hath(WF), he can(CW) not be(WF) my disciple(CW).

  • WW --Wrong Word -- The word translated as "whosoever " should be something more like "all."
  • IW - Inserted Word-- The "he be" doesn't exist in the source.
  • CW --Confusing Word -- The "of" does not capture the word's specific meaning.
  • CW --Confusing Word -- This is not the common verb form usually translated as "he."
  • CW --Confusing Word -- The "forsake" doesn't precisely mean "forsake."
  • WF -- Wrong Form -  This "he" is not a subject but a possessive.
  • WF -- Wrong Form -  This is not an active verb but a participle, a verbal adjective, used as a noun, "possessions."
  • CW - Confusing Word -- The "can" is not a helper verb, but the active verb in the sentence.
  • WF - Wrong Form -  The "infinitive" is not an active verb but an infinitive, "to infinitive."
  • CW --Confusing Word --  The word "disciple" has a religious meaning that the Greek word didn't have.

# NIV TRANSLATION ISSUES: 

10

In the same way, (MWtherefore) those(WW) of(CW) you(CW, WF) who do not [give up(CW)] everything(CW, WF) you have(WF) can(CW) not be(WF) my disciple(CW)

  • MW - Missing Word -- The word "therefore"  after "in this mannager" is not shown in the English translation.
  • WW --Wrong Word -- The word translated as "those" should be something more like "all."
  • CW --Confusing Word -- The "of" does not capture the word's specific meaning.
  • CW --Confusing Word -- This is not the common verb form usually translated as "you."
  • CW --Confusing Word -- The "give up" doesn't precisely mean "forsake."
  • WF -- Wrong Form -  This "you" is not a subject but a possessive.
  • WF -- Wrong Form -  This "can"  is not an active verb but a participle, a verbal adjective, used as a noun, "possessions."
  • CW - Confusing Word -- The "can" is not a helper verb, but the active verb in the sentence.
  • WF - Wrong Form -  The "infinitive" is not an active verb but an infinitive, "to infinitive."
  • CW --Confusing Word --  The word "disciple" has a religious meaning that the Greek word didn't have.

EACH WORD of KJV : 

So --  The word translated in KJV as "so" is in its adverbial form, so it means "in this manner," "so, "so much," or "so excessively."

likewise, -- The Greek word translated as "likewise" either emphasizes the truth of something ("certainly," "really") or it simply continues an existing narrative, "then," "therefore." Here, "likewise" is used to continue the narative.

whosoever -- (WW) The word translated as "whosoever " is the Greek adjective meaning "all," "the whole," "every," and similar ideas. When it is used as a noun, we would say "everything." As an adverb, it means "in every way," "on every side," and "altogether."This word doesn't mean "whosoever."

he be -- (IW) This word is not in the Greek source.

of -- (CW) The Greek preposition translated as "of" means "out of" or "from." The word also means "beyond," "on," "in," "since," or "by" based upon its context, but it indicates separation "from" something rather than being a part "of "it like "of" does. It is also used to describe the author or means "by" which something is done, especially with passive verbs. 

you -- The word translated as "you" is a plural, second-person pronoun in the possessive (genitive) case. This pronoun follows the noun so the possessive "of yours." When it precedes a definite article before the word it modifies, the sense may be "yours" or "part of you."

that -- The word translated as "who" is a demonstrative pronoun ("this" "that"), but it often acts as a pronoun, "he," "she," "it," "which," "what," "who," "whosoever," "where," "when," "for which reason," and many similar meanings. In the neuter, plural, its sense is "these things."

forsaketh -- (CW) "Forsaketh" is a verb that Jesus only uses here that means to "set apart", "assign specially", "detach" soldiers, "appoint", "settle definitely", and "bid adieu" to a person.  Since this isn't addressed to a person, the sense is "set aside."  This word doesn't precisely mean "forsake."

not -- The Greek word translated as "not" is the Greek negative used to deny objective facts, not opinions. It means "no," "not," or"no truly." It makes a negative statement of fact. When a negative precedes the verb, it affects the whole clause. When it precedes other words, its force is limited to those words. 

all -- The word translated as "all" is the Greek adjective meaning "all," "the whole," "every," and similar ideas. When it is used as a noun, we would say "everything." As an adverb, it means "in every way," "on every side," and "altogether."

that -- The word translated as "that" is the Greek definite article, "the," which usually precedes a noun or changes the word it precedes (adjective, infinitive, participle, etc.) to act like a noun. The Greek article is much closer to our demonstrative pronouns ("this," "that," "these," "those") than the English "the." See this article for more. 

he -- -- (CW, WF) "He" is a special reflexive pronoun that means "himself," "herself," and so on. " When used in the possessive, it has the sense of "his own." This is not the verb form usually translated as "he."  This is not a subject but a possessive.

hath, - (WF) "Hath" is from a participle of a verb not an active verb. The verb means "to take the initiative", "to begin." As a participle used as a noun, it means, "possessions", "resources, and "the past record." 

he -- This is from the third-person, singular form of the verb.

can-- (CW) The word translated as "can" means having the power or possibly a desire to accomplish something. Often, in English, "can" is a helper verb, indicating a possibility. In Greek, it indicates ability or power. This is the active verb here, not a helper verb. It takes an infinitive as "have the ability" does in English. In English, "can" is a helper verb, indicating a possibility. See this article.

not -- The Greek word translated as "not" is the Greek negative used to deny objective facts, not opinions. It means "no," "not," or"no truly." It makes a negative statement of fact. When a negative precedes the verb, it affects the whole clause. When it precedes other words, its force is limited to those words. 

be  -- (WF) The verb "be" here is the common form of "to be" in Greek. It means to have a certain characteristic or remain in a certain condition. It also equates terms or assigns characteristics.  The word also means "to exist" and where it doesn't connect to characteristics or conditions.This is not an active verb, but an infinitive.

my -- "My" is the first-person possessive singular pronoun, "my," "me," and "mine." Usually follows the noun so, "of mine.

disciple. -- (CW) "Disciple" is from the Greek meaning "learner," "pupil," "student," and "apprentice." "Disciple" is a religious spin on this concept, but that sense is not in the Greek word. The word "disciple" has a religious meaning that the Greek word didn't have.

EACH WORD of NIV : 

In the same way, --  The word translated in KJV as "so" is in its adverbial form, so it means "in this manner," "so, "so much," or "so excessively."

missing "therefore"  -- (MW) The untranslated word  "therefore" either emphasizes the truth of something ("certainly," "really") or it simply continues an existing narrative, "then," "therefore." Jesus uses it to respond positively to questions, but in parables, it can continue the story.

those -- (WW) The word translated as "those" is the Greek adjective meaning "all," "the whole," "every," and similar ideas. When it is used as a noun, we would say "everything." As an adverb, it means "in every way," "on every side," and "altogether."This word doesn't mean "whosoever."

of -- (CW) The Greek preposition translated as "of" means "out of" or "from." The word also means "beyond," "on," "in," "since," or "by" based upon its context, but it indicates separation "from" something rather than being a part "of "it like "of" does. It is also used to describe the author or means "by" which something is done, especially with passive verbs. 

you -- The word translated as "you" is a plural, second-person pronoun in the possessive (genitive) case. This pronoun follows the noun so the possessive "of yours." When it precedes a definite article before the word it modifies, the sense may be "yours" or "part of you."

who -- The word translated as "who" is a demonstrative pronoun ("this" "that"), but it often acts as a pronoun, "he," "she," "it," "which," "what," "who," "whosoever," "where," "when," "for which reason," and many similar meanings. In the neuter, plural, its sense is "these things."

do -- This helping verb is used to create questions, commands, negative statements, and smooth word flow in English.

not -- The Greek word translated as "not" is the Greek negative used to deny objective facts, not opinions. It means "no," "not," or"no truly." It makes a negative statement of fact. When a negative precedes the verb, it affects the whole clause. When it precedes other words, its force is limited to those words. 

give up -- (CW) "give up " is a verb that Jesus only uses here that means to "set apart", "assign specially", "detach" soldiers, "appoint", "settle definitely", and "bid adieu" to a person.  Since this isn't addressed to a person, the sense is "set aside."  This word doesn't precisely mean "give up."

everything -- The word translated as "everything " is the Greek adjective meaning "all," "the whole," "every," and similar ideas. When it is used as a noun, we would say "everything." As an adverb, it means "in every way," "on every side," and "altogether."

you have cannot be my disciples.

you -- -- (WF) "You" is a special reflexive pronoun that means "himself," "herself," "yourself," and so on. " When used in the possessive, it has the sense of "his own." This is not the verb form usually translated as "you."  This is not a subject but a possessive.

have , - (WF) "Have" is from a participle of a verb not an active verb. The verb means "to take the initiative", "to begin." As a participle used as a noun, it means, "possessions", "resources, and "the past record."

can-- (CW) The word translated as "can" means having the power or possibly a desire to accomplish something. Often, in English, "can" is a helper verb, indicating a possibility. In Greek, it indicates ability or power. This is the active verb here, not a helper verb. It takes an infinitive as "have the ability" does in English. In English, "can" is a helper verb, indicating a possibility. See this article.

not -- The Greek word translated as "not" is the Greek negative used to deny objective facts, not opinions. It means "no," "not," or"no truly." It makes a negative statement of fact. When a negative precedes the verb, it affects the whole clause. When it precedes other words, its force is limited to those words. 

be  -- (WF) The verb "be" here is the common form of "to be" in Greek. It means to have a certain characteristic or remain in a certain condition. It also equates terms or assigns characteristics.  The word also means "to exist" and where it doesn't connect to characteristics or conditions.This is not an active verb, but an infinitive.

my -- "My" is the first-person possessive singular pronoun, "my," "me," and "mine." Usually follows the noun so, "of mine.

disciple. -- (CW) "Disciple" is from the Greek meaning "learner," "pupil," "student," and "apprentice." "Disciple" is a religious spin on this concept, but that sense is not in the Greek word. The word "disciple" has a religious meaning that the Greek word didn't have.

COMPARISON: GREEK to KJV : 

οὕτως [54 verses](adv) "So" is houtos, an adverb that means "in this way," "therefore," "so much" ("for" w/gen.), "to such an extent," "so very," "so excessively," and "that is why. With an imperative "just," "without more ado." At beginning of a story, "once upon a time."

οὖν [82 verses](adv) "Likewise" is oun, which means "certainly," "in fact," "really," "in fact," "so" and "then" (continuing a narrative), and "then" and "therefore."

πᾶς  [212 verses] (adj sg masc nom ) "Whosoever" is pas, which means "all," "the whole," "every," "anyone," "all kinds," and "anything." In the adverbial form, it means "every way," "on every side," "in every way," and "altogether."

ἐκ  [121 verses] (prep) "Of" is ek , which means 1) [of motion] "out of," "from," "by," "away from;" 2) [of place] "beyond," "outside of," "beyond;" 3) [of succession] "after," "from;" 4) [of rest] "on," "in," 5) [of time] "since," "from," "at," "in;" 7) [of materials] "out of," "made from;" 7) cause, instrument, or means "by." It is also used to describe the author or means "by" which something is done, especially with passive verbs.-- The Greek preposition translated as "from" means "out of" or "from." The word has a number of different meanings based upon its context, but it indicates separation "from" something rather than being a part "of "it like "of" does. It is also used to describe the author or means "by" which something is done, especially with passive verbs.

ὑμῶν [168 verses](pron 2nd pl gen) "Your/you" is humon, the plural possessive form of su the pronoun of the second person, "you." It is either a possessive pronoun or the object of a preposition. As an object of a preposition, the genitive indicates movement away or a position away from something.

ὃς  [294 verses](pron sg masc nom ) "That" is hos, which means "this," "that," "he," "she," "it," "which," "what," "who," "whosoever," "where," "when," " "for which reason," and many similar meanings. In the neuter, plural, its sense is "these things."

οὐκ [269 verses](adv) "Not" is ou , the negative adverb for facts and statements, negating both single words and sentences.  The negative, οὐ, denies, is absolute, and objective.

ἀποτάσσεται [1 verse](verb 3rd sg pres ind mp) "Forsaketh" is apotasso, which means to "set apart", "assign specially", "detach" soldiers, "appoint", "settle definitely", and "bid adieu" to a person.

πᾶσιν [212 verses] (adj pl masc dat) "All" is pas, which means "all," "the whole," "every," "anyone," "all kinds," and "anything." In the adverbial form, it means "every way," "on every side," "in every way," and "altogether."

τοῖς [821 verses](article pl masc dat) "That" is the Greek definite article, hos, ("the").   It usually precedes a noun or changes the word it precedes (adjective, infinitive, participle, etc.) to act like a noun. When not preceding a a word that can become a noun, takes the meaning of "the one" or, in the plural, "the ones." 

ἑαυτοῦ (adj sg masc gen) "He" [75 verses](adj sg fem gen) "Himself" is heautou, is a reflexive pronoun that means "himself," "herself," "itself" "themselves," and "ourselves." It is not the common pronoun meaning simply "he," "she," "them," etc. In the genitive form, it has the sense of "his own."

ὑπάρχουσιν [8 verses](part pl pres act masc dat) "Hath"  is from hyparchonta, which is the participle form of hyparcho, which means "to take the initiative", "to begin", "take the initiative in","to be the beginning", "to exist really", "to be laid down", "to be taken for granted", and of persons "to be devoted to one." In this form, a participle used as a noun, it means "existing circumstances", "present advantages", "possessions", "resources, "that which is in existence," and "the past record." -

οὐ [269 verses](adv) "Not" is ou , the negative adverb for facts and statements, negating both single words and sentences.  The negative, οὐ, denies, is absolute, and objective. -- The Greek word translated as "not" is the Greek negative used to deny objective facts, not opinions. It means "no," "not," or"no truly." It makes a negative statement of fact. When a negative precedes the verb, it affects the whole clause. When it precedes other words, its force is limited to those words. 

δύναται [61 verses](3rd sg pres ind mp) "Can" is the verb, dynamai, which means "to have power by virtue of your own capabilities," "to be able," and "to be strong enough."

εἶναί [614 verses] (verb pres inf act) "Be" is eimi, which means "to be," "to exist," "to be the case," of circumstance and events "to happen,"  and "is possible." With the possessive (genitive) object, it means "is descended from," "is the type of," "belongs to," "is made of," "is a duty of," "is at the mercy of," or " is dependent on." With an indirect (dative) object, it means "have" where the subject and object are reversed.  "It is to him" becomes "it is his" or "he has it."  With the preposition,"into" (εἰς), the sense is "consist of." When the verb "to be" appears early in the clause before the subject, the sense is more like "it is" or, in the plural, "there are."

μου [239 verses](adj sg masc gen) "My" is from mou (emou), which means "me," and "mine."  It is in a possessive (genitive) form.  As a genitive of a preposition here, it implies movement away from something or a position away from something else.

μαθητὴς [13 verses](noun sg masc nom) "Disciple" is mathetes, which means "learner," "pupil," "student," and "apprentice."

Related Verses: 

Front Page Date: 

Sep 25 2024